Bob50
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Post by Bob50 on Oct 22, 2020 23:17:20 GMT
Just one useful tip from real practice if you feel that a confrontation could occur. For right hand people: Bend the left arm and keep it at the stomach level. Put the right elbow on the left hand (palm) and touch your chin like you think about something. Usually an opponent does not realize that you are in the perfect defensive stance with closed main vital body areas and does not expect your fast attack/counterattack. But from this stance, you can block or/and strike by any hand very quick. You also can block leg kicks easy. It really works well, especially if you use Xing Yi strike techniques.
P.S. if you feel more comfortable, bend your right arm and put the left elbow on the right palm. Frequently, more comfortable position of arms is related to your preferable stance. Good example of very fast counterattack from this position is simultaneos block by left arm a straight strike by right knuckles to the nose or by fingers to the throat or eyes. It is almost impossible to block this strike if you use your body like a spring.
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macky
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Post by macky on Oct 23, 2020 1:31:43 GMT
Yes but Robert Smith also spoke about (and followed, himself) a number of different techniques as a base for a personal fighting system. The point is that the number of said techniques is kept down to a reasonable minimum and each trained equally, so that when the heat's on, you don't have to think about what you're going to do next. It's similar to boxing in way. There's only so many different punches, and when you're fighting through the red mist those punches will be employed automatically, or as near as possible. That's also why I recommend anyone who wants to follow a genuine martial art, go and spend 3-6 months in the boxing ring first, being walloped around and learning what it's like fighting under duress, remembering once again that getting hit with a bare fist is much worse than a gloved fist. And make sure your opponent is at your own level, or near to it. Karateka for example of many years standing have simply gone to pieces when an accidental punch sent them to the floor. Their training is incomplete, no matter what colour belt they wear. I'm no fighter but in my opinion, it's no good if you train (say) a low front kick with your right foot, when the foot is in plaster from a previous accident. Fights happen suddenly and you can't plan for the day when you're gonna be able to use your prime weapon. If that is all you've got to rely on, with the rest of your techniques sort of half-pie, then you're probably in deep trouble. Baz has got it right when he's talking about 4 or 5 techniques. Even the Pakua circling (which is definitely something quite different) a la Robert Smith's book has only 5-6 techniques, all of them trained into the sub/superconcious so that no concious thought is needed to employ them. Although the training emphasis is different, it's the same thing whether internal or external. I agree with most of what you are saying, but I honestly can't really see a lot of these martial arts actually doing much in a real situation. I know we've talked about this before and you have said that we don't see the real, brutal method as it is too dangerous to use in anything but a real life threatening situation, but watching videos of many of these styles, they only seem to work against a cooperative partner. Even when you watch the masters, students are coming at them with exagerrated movements, making it very clear what they are going to do. I would be happy to watch something that changes my opinion, but not seen it yet. Something wjefe someone uses these techniques to any effect with a well trained boxer / thai boxer comong at them. I do admit that if a martial artist can get then down with a throw or somecsort of hold then it could easily sway the fight. But any fancy martial arts punch that veers from a boxing punch, it's surely got to be watered down and less powerful and efficient. Well I think you may find that the most direct and effective martial art techniques are pretty much the same as what Baz and others here have promoted. I'm a bit dicky about martial arts schools mainly because they cannot possibly perform such techniques at full power with out maiming or killing their "opponent". That's another reason for the boxing for a few months. You've got gloves on, and you're punching not kicking or trying to grab the nuts etc. But it teaches you to be able to fight through pain (up to a point) and keep on when you are virtually out on your feet. In the street, that short finger stab to the throat when you're nearly done for may be your saving grace. But you gotta get into the mindset under pressure, and as far as I know, boxing in the gym is the safest way of getting it, providing your opponent is either about the same ability and power, or he's very much superior but is deliberately holding back for your training. In the six months I was the gym punchbag, we punched each other with full power (otherwise how would you ever know your hitting power? ) and some nights I would have as many as nine "professional" rounds with three different guys, usually those that had visited to polish a few techniques before going off up or down NZ for Golden Gloves, or simply a town hall fight. To say I cannot remember much of it would be an understatement, but it taught me not to give up, to keep on punching even when you cant see your target (because you are nearly out on your feet) and to hit as hard as you can at all times. I got multiple latherings because I wasn't any clever boxer that's for sure, but I was never knocked off my feet, just once sat on the middle rope when a straight cross broke my nose. I stood straight back up and kept going, never mind the claret. When that happened, we were taught to keep on brushing down your nose with your hand so it never set. My nose looks normal except for a little off-centre, but if I hit it, I don't feel it as much, even at 72. It was another reason why they liked me for a spar partner. They could go fell out and I wouldn't go down. Do NOT take punches repeatedly unless you are fit, and if you're knocked out, take a few months off before you take punches again. Still skip and hit the bag. The heaviest one. If you can move that, you can stop an opponent's momentum towards you and make him think twice. That's not the kind of fighting experience you're gonna get in the average martial arts class. All the fancy kata go out the window when the pain sets in, and if your martial arts has not trained you to accept incoming and keep responding, then you're going to very disappointed. Train your grip. It might be the last thing you've got when you're being thrown around by a larger person and can't get into position for even a quick jab. If you can crush a No,1 COC gripper for say six squeezes down to the the handles, it's gonna make a difference when you grab his ear, his nuts, his hair or his throat. Even a raking claw down his face. Have a look at what Bob said too. Like Baz, he's experienced.
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moxohol
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Si vis pacem, para bellum
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Post by moxohol on Oct 23, 2020 3:31:28 GMT
Moxohol I'm sorry that stuff happened to you. Even though that really happened to you, the way you described it was hilarious. I always thought you were just a little weird but you are pretty funny. U know: ur right. Others have leveled the same observations. I'm sorry. I am weird but that incident & my description of it is just my own peculiar form of hysteria in dealing with it. For me, it was life changing. For my wife, she got cranked about it. Basically, she ranted: What were u thinking.? Are u insane? Ur 58 years old not some butt hurt kid! Ur suppose to know better! It was a moment of clarity there when she popped me with that stuff. I am 58 years old & not a kid anymore. The other guy was around his 40s & simply a loudmouth. In all honesty & self reflection, I did react badly without thinking. He got into a heated argument with my wife & started cursing her out & standing over her but he never touched or threatened her. I thought I did the right thing but obviously not by the upset it caused her & others. I'm terrible at reading ppl & situations. I feel bad that it happened at all. At least I'm not sleeping on the couch anymore. BOO-YAH!
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macky
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Post by macky on Oct 23, 2020 4:33:54 GMT
Moxohol I'm sorry that stuff happened to you. Even though that really happened to you, the way you described it was hilarious. I always thought you were just a little weird but you are pretty funny. U know: ur right. Others have leveled the same observations. I'm sorry. I am weird but that incident & my description of it is just my own peculiar form of hysteria in dealing with it. For me, it was life changing. For my wife, she got cranked about it. Basically, she ranted: What were u thinking.? Are u insane? Ur 58 years old not some butt hurt kid! Ur suppose to know better! It was a moment of clarity there when she popped me with that stuff. I am 58 years old & not a kid anymore. The other guy was around his 40s & simply a loudmouth. In all honesty & self reflection, I did react badly without thinking. He got into a heated argument with my wife & started cursing her out & standing over her but he never touched or threatened her. I thought I did the right thing but obviously not by the upset it caused her & others. I'm terrible at reading ppl & situations. I feel bad that it happened at all. At least I'm not sleeping on the couch anymore. BOO-YAH! It's all right Mox. It's one thing to take abuse yourself, but quite another to stand there while your wife is being insulted and brow-beaten. It IS threatening, and you don't know if the bastard could take a swing at any time. He could be on meth or something. I would have done the same.
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moxohol
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Post by moxohol on Oct 23, 2020 12:26:11 GMT
Immigrant Song Cover in Old Norse 700 A.D - 1500 A.D (BARDCORE or SKALDCORE?)
===================================== All this talk of fightin' n stuff has got me pumped. ARRRRRRRRGH! (mead anyone?)
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moxohol
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Si vis pacem, para bellum
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Post by moxohol on Oct 23, 2020 13:04:56 GMT
The chin jab & knee strike I did on the guy was worthy of a BBC instant replay in slow motion & a victory run across the field. How more self defense training do u need then that? All it did was piss him off. I even manage to jump on his back & put him in a figure 4 & body lock. It pissed him off even more. I'm 73kg. I'm not that diesel. He was 100kg easy. Does the phase, "biting off more then u can chew" come to mind? I attempted to choke him out. WRONG! Have u got any idea of what an impact against a wall (multiple times), a kitchen counter or a floor is like when someone is mad? It was all l could do to HOLD ON. I'm upset to hear you had to go through an ordeal like this. No civility left in humans. Animals act more civil to each other. No idea what's causing this (5G, GMO's, COVID, drugs, etc.) but human evolution seems to be on the decline. Sincerely hope you are ok and recover. Thanks. Healing is a foregone conclusion. No permanent damage. Mental state? *meh* But no more action cameos! Put me out pasture & place a cow bell on me.
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Dave Reslo
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Post by Dave Reslo on Oct 23, 2020 17:44:32 GMT
Something I have wondered about a lot is what if you were to focus on one move, maybe 90% of your practice was with this one striking move (for example). Let's say you chose a right elbow. If you put in the time, the months if not years working this move inside out. You worked on speed, non telegraphing, accuracy, power, firing from the hips in the blink of an eye etc. You absolutely mastered it, using different targets, different surfaces and it was lightening quick, deadly accurate and very powerful. Would that be a good approach? Of course, relying on one move is risky, but you probably only need to land it once and you have invested so much undiluted time that you have a very good chance of doing that. If it fails, well you have probably at least developed some conditioning and reflexes etc to help you out. I kind of like the sound of this, and to be honest I probably got the idea after reading some Robert Smith books. I've spent a long time trying to master basically two variations of the straight right, but even when I was sparring regularly it was difficult to implement it exactly the way I liked. There's still a sort of mental aspect to it which made it worth while to me, but I'm kind of on the fence about whether it is a good idea from a practical standpoint.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 23, 2020 18:31:21 GMT
I like this video as the man preaches keeping things simple and leaving the flashy techniques in the dojo
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 23, 2020 18:33:26 GMT
Another man Mick Coup a man who teaches straight forward and basic techniques for self defence talks about martial arts being bullshit for the streets!
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moxohol
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Post by moxohol on Oct 23, 2020 20:16:19 GMT
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brothersteve
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Post by brothersteve on Oct 23, 2020 20:59:55 GMT
THIS guy is why keeping distance is so important....if they can get close enough and have speed and some skill you can get hurt bad.
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brothersteve
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Post by brothersteve on Oct 23, 2020 21:20:56 GMT
I like this video as the man preaches keeping things simple and leaving the flashy techniques in the dojo Beautiful! THIS guy is spot on! I was always prepared like he said, no palm though, fingers slightly bent like a claw and go for eye, face rake, throat, and low kick somewhere doing at least 2 of the 3, if not all 3. When you hit somebody in 3 places at once, in vital spots , hard AND fast that's the best.
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Dave Reslo
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Post by Dave Reslo on Oct 23, 2020 23:09:54 GMT
Not sure if anyone has mentioned him in this thread but a few people here used to be fans of Steve Morris. He had a certain very particular way of doing fairly standard techniques and a lot of emphasis on natural movement, that sort of thing. No doubt a lot of innate ability particularly in his punching power but he seemed to do the best he could to reverse engineer what worked for him. He started off as a karate guy but got away from that and I think now instructs for both MMA and self defense. There's loads of videos he's put online but I couldn't pick a favourite.
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Bob50
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Do what you can do, listen to your body, feel your body, drive your body.
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Post by Bob50 on Oct 24, 2020 1:00:30 GMT
Yeah, it resembles Xing Yi techniques - fast, straight, and brutal attacks with moving into an opponent space as a defensive tactics.
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moxohol
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Post by moxohol on Oct 24, 2020 4:18:05 GMT
Yeah, it resembles Xing Yi techniques - fast, straight, and brutal attacks with moving into an opponent space as a defensive tactics. The above named video is a style famously promoted by Willem Reeders. He was a prominent dutch eurasian of WW2 combat experience. Chris Derbaum, the head sensei in the video, is the slap-happy Correctional Officer from Ft. Meyers Florida. Liu Seong Kuntao - Wikipedia en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liu_Seong_Kuntao
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