MBS
Caneguru
Lean, lithe and feral
Posts: 1,301
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Post by MBS on Aug 11, 2018 17:41:15 GMT
I think a plant based diet, with an emphasis on greens, with seasonal fruits, coupled with small amounts of high quality animal proteins, lots of water, and if desired, moderate amounts of alcohol, works best, at least for me. No “ ism’s”, no dogma. I'm not -- to restate, not -- vegan. However, I do learn a lot from the vegan authors. I've tried it...a lot of positives, some negatives. But -- opinion only -- unless you know how to properly create a proper vegan diet and take the required nutrients that are completely missing from the diet, you're taking a chance with your long term health. For example, if a vegan doesn't consume Vitamin B-12 regularly, they will face serious health issues and death. People with multiple titles after their names like Ben Greenfield and even vegan MD Joel Kahn have a list of specific amino acids that are recommended. Not worth going hard core unless it is absolutely critical to your health. People with autoimmune diseases such as lupus, certain cancers, etc., may see miracles as a result of going vegan. But, I keep animal proteins to around 60g/day (may range as high as 70 and as low as 30) which is where the people who have dug into the science...Rosedale, Longo -- too many to name...have recommended. And no loss in strength, etc., and a lower grocery bill. Today, my first "meal" was at 10am which included a "protein" shake using a vegan protein someone gave me to try out (jury's out on taste -- right now, blech) and with a peach and pecans. So, 25g/protein so far today. I’ve learned a lot too from vegan authors too. While I don’t keep track of how much protein I consume, I’d guess, on average,between 50-75 grams a day from animal sources I try to keep it simple, ala the Michael Pollan approach.
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Post by vegetus25 on Aug 11, 2018 18:10:14 GMT
Texas, A vegan diet just isn't that hard. Sure, you have to supplement B-12, but meat eaters supplement it too. Their B-12 supplement is just given to an animal first . If anyone is going to eat healthy (vegan or not) they have to pay some attention to creating a healthy diet. This is not just a vegan thing. I would also say that there are many things in an animal based diet that seem to be harmful to long-term health that a vegan does not have to worry about. All that said, while I do not eat animals or things that come from them, I do not like calling myself a vegan. I do it for simplicity, but it has become too charged for my liking.
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Michael
Caneguru
He cuts down trees. He wears high heels, suspendies, and a bra?!
Winner of Twatformetrics Spartan Challenge
Posts: 5,288
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Post by Michael on Aug 11, 2018 20:10:58 GMT
It seems like every month a new claim is made for something.....these people could make you crazy if you paid attention to them Supplements Meat Vegan This exercise program That exercise program In the end, it all starts to sound like bullshit Just my opinion but Eat moderately Eat a variety of foods Don't pay any attention to these gurus Exercise regularly Do a variety of exercise Feel the exercise Use common sense Don't obsess over supplements Learn to truly listen to your body If it hurts....stop, WTF ! I like this very well said!
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Mr Average
Caneguru
Kegal Grand Master, 8th Dan BlackBelt in Origami, World Champion Couch Potato
Posts: 1,461
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Post by Mr Average on Aug 11, 2018 21:06:23 GMT
John Joseph is a musician, author and triathlete from New York City, most famous for his work as the lead singer of the Cro-Mags in the 1980s.
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TexasRanger
Caneguru
A little here, a little there...
Posts: 2,223
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Post by TexasRanger on Aug 11, 2018 21:37:30 GMT
Texas, A vegan diet just isn't that hard. Sure, you have to supplement B-12, but meat eaters supplement it too. Their B-12 supplement is just given to an animal first . If anyone is going to eat healthy (vegan or not) they have to pay some attention to creating a healthy diet. This is not just a vegan thing. I would also say that there are many things in an animal based diet that seem to be harmful to long-term health that a vegan does not have to worry about. All that said, while I do not eat animals or things that come from them, I do not like calling myself a vegan. I do it for simplicity, but it has become too charged for my liking. Hi Veg, Good point on the B-12. And agree 100% on your point regarding what a non-vegan needs to be aware of that a vegan doesn't need to. Well stated. But, vegan Dr. Kahn, for example, recommends the following supplements: drjoelkahn.com/supplements-recommend-plant-based-patients/ I can cite others (on the other end of the spectrum we know McDougall doesn't feel they are needed). You'll note there are several amino acids listed. Fuhrman advocates a DHA/EPA supplement since vegans may not get enough in their diets along with B-12. Now, let me give you one example of the difficulty of a vegan diet: traveling, some hotels don't offer healthy plant-based foods. Donuts, eggs (some type of yellow scrambled), sugar-laden yogurt, bacon and old fruit -- and badabing, badaboom-- waffles in some places. Not 100% across the board, but, depending on where you end up many times that is your choice. Lunch and/or dinner, many times, not my choice. For example, here are two places that I ate: www.thevarsity.com/food gusfriedchicken.com/atlanta-georgia-location/ Neither were my choice...tried to opt for something a little healthier but I was voted down but picked up the bill. And Rolaids were quickly consumed after both meals...don't know how people can eat like that all the time. Anyway, when I'm at home? Sure...at least two meals are veg. No problemo...
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MBS
Caneguru
Lean, lithe and feral
Posts: 1,301
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Post by MBS on Aug 11, 2018 21:47:39 GMT
^^^^^when you travel a lot, even when you have knowledge and the best intentions, it is much more difficult to eat clean, especially if your peers/ work associates are not on the same page as you.
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macky
Caneguru
Upside down
CLUELESS TOSSER
Posts: 2,828
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Post by macky on Aug 11, 2018 22:00:32 GMT
I gave up the 40oz bottle of bourbon or gin or vodka a day some time ago. It wasn't every day but it was around at least 3 days a week. Beer was only an appetizer. Steam. The rocket fuel was the go. I saw spiders, two feet wide, comin' to get me. I told them to piss off. Dry 39 years this October. I'm glad there are sensible drinkers here. It's for them that alcohol is fine.
I have a vague in-diet. A bit of everything but not too much of anything. Always try to pull in some greens somewhere. Beans often just by themselves. No huge meals, just a medium amount with no dessert. Tea, cocoa. Eat when hungry, not to the clock. Try to stay away from as much processed food as possible. Minimum sugar.
Just to add, I'm amused by the dear ones who will not eat animals because of the killing and suffering involved. I know that the guys here are perfectly reasonable, but the odd person I encounter from time to time who is veg or vegan comes up with said moralistic tone, which I find a bit confusing actually.
They do not like the idea of an animal being dispatched quickly and hopefully as painless as possible, but think nothing of hauling a lettuce out of the ground (a living entity), cutting the arse off the poor unfortunate (the roots) then taking it inside and tearing the leaves off it while still alive (you know, eat 'live' food, right? )
Since when did you pull the legs off an animal while it was still alive ?
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Post by gruntbrain on Aug 12, 2018 2:21:59 GMT
In the last few months I've included hemp seeds in my mostly plant based diet . They're low carb, high healthy fats, with decent amounts of fiber and protein .
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TexasRanger
Caneguru
A little here, a little there...
Posts: 2,223
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Post by TexasRanger on Aug 12, 2018 2:49:41 GMT
I gave up the 40oz bottle of bourbon or gin or vodka a day some time ago. It wasn't every day but it was around at least 3 days a week. Beer was only an appetizer. Steam. The rocket fuel was the go. I saw spiders, two feet wide, comin' to get me. I told them to piss off. Dry 39 years this October. I'm glad there are sensible drinkers here. It's for them that alcohol is fine.
I have a vague in-diet. A bit of everything but not too much of anything. Always try to pull in some greens somewhere. Beans often just by themselves. No huge meals, just a medium amount with no dessert. Tea, cocoa. Eat when hungry, not to the clock. Try to stay away from as much processed food as possible. Minimum sugar.
Just to add, I'm amused by the dear ones who will not eat animals because of the killing and suffering involved. I know that the guys here are perfectly reasonable, but the odd person I encounter from time to time who is veg or vegan comes up with said moralistic tone, which I find a bit confusing actually.
They do not like the idea of an animal being dispatched quickly and hopefully as painless as possible, but think nothing of hauling a lettuce out of the ground (a living entity), cutting the arse off the poor unfortunate (the roots) then taking it inside and tearing the leaves off it while still alive (you know, eat 'live' food, right? )
Since when did you pull the legs off an animal while it was still alive ?
While I have 100% respect vegans who do it for health reasons, due to the absolutely horrid conditions cattle, poultry and pork are forced to endure up through what is many, many times a miserable, draw-out death or even for the environment -- cattle consume a horrific amount of water for a pound of meat, when a vegan takes the moral high ground simply because they are vegan, I have to ask "to grow the crops that you eat -- whether beans, greans, fruit or nuts -- they come from where? Land that has been "cleared" to raise crops, grow trees, etc. And what animals are displaced or killed so that the farmer can grow your food?" To me, the biggest issue are the crimes the slaughterhouses and even cattle, pork and poultry producers get away with when it comes to how these animals are treated to make sure we have dirt cheap burgers and chicken wings.
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Post by DDH on Aug 12, 2018 3:48:35 GMT
Hell,I'm a retired Meat cutter,but I have a rib eye steak or fillet mignon once a week and chicken once a week salmon once a week, and my cheat dinner on Monday which is pizza,I have no cholesterol issues and just had a physical a month ago,and my doctor said don't change a thing, keep doing what your doing, the other 3 days a week for dinner is a salad,I guess I'm kind of a pussy, it's all about moderation and Billfish I really like your post you posted earlier, you were spot on sir!
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Post by mr potatohead on Aug 13, 2018 13:29:46 GMT
"MEAT IS FOR PUSSIES"?
I suppose I could say that, in the interest of goodwill, I enjoy giving my meat to pussies and encourage all of you to experience that joy of giving.
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TexasRanger
Caneguru
A little here, a little there...
Posts: 2,223
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Post by TexasRanger on Aug 13, 2018 14:43:24 GMT
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Post by DrunkenMonkey on Aug 13, 2018 14:52:00 GMT
You're posting this after you had that thread on your sausage bake? Some of these vegans are whacked out....my wife was talking to a woman who is a vegan ( and looks like she tips the scales at 300 lbs ) and my wife mentioned that she eats eggs but limits herself on the yolks. The vegan was shocked and blurted out " But, they are the babies " ! Some human beings in general are just whacked out. The carnivore diet isn't any less whacked out. You have people out there promoting a diet consisting of nothing but beef, chicken, salt and water. Let's pretend that that at all improves your health or lifespan in any significant manner(which it almost certainly doesn't)--what kind of life are you really living if that's the entirety of your diet?
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Post by mr potatohead on Aug 13, 2018 15:16:48 GMT
I apply that to all real food. As long as it's real food, I eat a variety of plants and animals. I pay attention to what I fell hungry for. Sometimes, nothing can satisfy my hunger like a bloody steak, liver or heart from wild critters, beef, bison or chicken, but I really like the way I feel when I eat fish. I also follow meat eating with plenty of water.
It depends on the individual, apparently. Give your body what it thrives on, as long as it's real food.
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TexasRanger
Caneguru
A little here, a little there...
Posts: 2,223
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Post by TexasRanger on Aug 13, 2018 15:40:38 GMT
Ron Kosloff...bodybuilder? Don't think so. He re-sold Gironda's courses -- from what one person who knew Vince told me, without permission (I don't know, but, Vince's business after he passed was a mess)-- and has been in trouble with the FDA for some of his supplement sales. And what we know about Vince's passing: 1. He died of a massive heart attack. 2. He had heart issues for a number of years leading up to his death and reportedly several strokes. The guy who sold a lot of the eggs and heavy cream tales and BS that Vince advocated -- Rheo Blair -- died (reportedly) of a massive heart attack as well. As for Kosloff's tales of Indian Joe and the rest? His believability is about zero -- if you read some of his claims regarding Vince this and Vince that and how Vince produced all of these champions? BS. Larry Scott, Mohammed Makaway, Arnold, Reg Park, Don Howorth -- all heavy steroid users and were pretty much competitive bb'ers before they went to Vince's. Several sites have also speculated about Vince juicing, citing the fact he maintained a lot of muscularity while keeping a low % of bodyfat going into his 50s and 60s. Sorry, eating a carton of eggs and such isn't going to do that. Ron also claims to have a Bach of Science degree from the "Institute of Health Sciences". Well, look it up...they're akin to the fraudulent school Valerie Saxion and Johnny Bowden went to for their mail order degrees. And his grandfather tales sounds a 1:1 regarding the tales of g'pa snowrubber and his uncles from the short dude in the tightie whitey pants... I mean seriously...115 years old? I thought in this day and age BS like this would be questioned. Anyone see "Indian Joe" listed: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_verified_oldest_men
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