brothersteve
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Post by brothersteve on Aug 4, 2020 16:56:43 GMT
Because the virus has gotten to pandemic proportions, the thrust is toward herd immunity. Problem is that this virus shares aspects of the common cold and AIDS and is very contagious AND deadly. It mutates quickly and is deadly. The 'odd' thing is the incubation period which can be from days t weeks. There will be a vaccine, but it will serve useless due to the mutation strains, just like there is no vaccine for the common cold and AIDS - only treatments. It will only be a money maker for big pharma. The treatment side will be developed and if the virus doesn't kill you, then you may live for a while with no issues or be permanently injured with some condition. To me, it was man- made to cull the population. Easy way to get rid of the old and sick. I am very fearful of this virus. I feel like we humans are being targeted like the Sentinels did the mutants in the X men movie. I hope something other than a vaccine comes into play as a cure. Stay as healthy and vigilant as you can.
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macky
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Post by macky on Aug 5, 2020 1:19:19 GMT
There's been a Chinese scientist defector who is asserting the virus was laboratory manufactured. And a Trump interview by an Australian journalist on Covid 19 seems to have gone viral itself, with Trump burbling on incomprehensibly. No surprises there.
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macky
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Post by macky on Aug 7, 2020 3:42:17 GMT
Worldometer as of this morning (NZ) 5 million cases, 162,000 deaths. Down to less than 3 weeks since the last million was reached in the US.
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Post by BigBruvOfEnglandUK on Aug 8, 2020 5:53:09 GMT
April the 5th had 6199 cases in the UK. April the 12th was the peak in daily deaths with 986 deaths that day. May the 6th had 6201 cases so virtually the same amount of cases as April the 5th but daily deaths had decreased to on average to about 450 per day for the next 7 days. www.statista.com/statistics/1101947/coronavirus-cases-development-uk/Daily deaths didn't increase in the two week period after there were 6201 cases (Death if it occurs is usually within two weeks of covid-19 being confirmed). In fact the daily deaths decreased to about 345 two weeks after the largest number of cases and have continued to drop even after the lockdown ended. Daily deaths have been about 65 per day for about a week. That's not to say that daily deaths will decrease further. They may start to increase. If they do then other countries or states that already had their peaks should expect the daily deaths to start increasing again.
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Post by BigBruvOfEnglandUK on Aug 8, 2020 6:39:17 GMT
Looking at the US as a whole is a bit like looking at Europe as a whole. It doesn't really tell you the what is going on. Some US states and European countries had their peaks months ago while others had virtually nothing but are now seeing daily death numbers increasing. I know some people seem to be more concerned with case numbers than deaths so here's some good news for them. According to the CDC, case numbers have been on the decline in the US for the past two weeks or so even while daily deaths and case numbers have been increasing in some of the states. www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/cases-in-us.html
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macky
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Post by macky on Aug 8, 2020 8:13:13 GMT
Be good news if it was true. But not according to Worldometer. The number of cases has been increasing and is now over 5 million.
Sounds like the CDC might be cooking the numbers under White House orders. Who knows ? Looking at the map in your link, there's only about 16 states that are not dark blue (40k and over) and at the CDC figure of 4.8m+ is still big.
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Post by BigBruvOfEnglandUK on Aug 15, 2020 23:54:24 GMT
Both the CDC and Worldometer are saying the number of cases is well over 5 million so how is the CDC cooking the books?. The case numbers of over 5 million are all cases so far since the virus was first recorded in the US back in January. There's nowhere near 5 million active cases. Just because an area on the CDC map is dark blue it does not mean that the daily infection rate or daily deaths is increasing in that state. It means that the state has had over 40000 cases since records began. Several of those states are seeing a drop in daily infection rates and daily deaths and have been for months. Below is New York state's daily deaths. Neighbouring states New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Connecticut, Massachusetts and Vermont have similar looking graphs. Daily deaths in the US is less than half what it was in mid April. Check out the various states or countries for yourself by clicking the drop down arrow in the box that says "United States of America" or entering the name yourself. covid19.healthdata.org/united-states-of-america"Daily deaths is the best indicator of the progression of the pandemic, although there is generally a 17-21 day lag between infection and deaths."
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Post by mr potatohead on Aug 16, 2020 4:26:46 GMT
The only metric needed to evaluate severity of the sickness itself for comparison to average is "excess deaths" The bigger issue seems to me to be the ~ 2+x as many deaths of collateral damage resulting from the lockdowns.
EDIT: That is, assuming the report I heard about "~ 2+x as many ....." was true. I have not researched that.
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macky
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Post by macky on Aug 16, 2020 5:34:51 GMT
Both the CDC and Worldometer are saying the number of cases is well over 5 million so how is the CDC cooking the books?. The case numbers of over 5 million are all cases so far since the virus was first recorded in the US back in January. There's nowhere near 5 million active cases. Just because an area on the CDC map is dark blue it does not mean that the daily infection rate or daily deaths is increasing in that state. It means that the state has had over 40000 cases since records began. Several of those states are seeing a drop in daily infection rates and daily deaths and have been for months. Below is New York state's daily deaths. Neighbouring states New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Connecticut, Massachusetts and Vermont have similar looking graphs. Daily deaths in the US is less than half what it was in mid April. Check out the various states or countries for yourself by clicking the drop down arrow in the box that says "United States of America" or entering the name yourself. covid19.healthdata.org/united-states-of-america"Daily deaths is the best indicator of the progression of the pandemic, although there is generally a 17-21 day lag between infection and deaths." Well the CDC possibly cooking the books was only a speculative remark. Given the utter confusion in the US, and Trump's behaviour, I wouldn't put it past the White House to exert pressure. Just an ask. With the White House requiring the hospital stats now, is the CDC still receiving them directly from the hospitals, or only getting its numbers from the White House ? If it is, then my speculation may have some grounding. The dark blue states still show that there have been over 40k recorded cases, whether the numbers are increasing or not, or active. It is only a broad indication of the extent of the Covid 19 infections. "Daily deaths is the best indicator of the progression of the pandemic, although there is generally a 17-21 day lag between infection and deaths." I do not believe the above statement for one single moment. The focus primarily on deaths is unrealistic as to the progress (or not) of the pandemic. If you have only (say) .0001% of deaths recorded in some pandemic, while the overall number of cases soar past 5 Million in the United States, can you seriously say that the pandemic is nearly over ? Of course not. It's actually now over 5.5 million just in a matter of days. That means that whether some of that number are "recovered", the overall number in the US in general is increasing exponentially. And of course mikey has made a good point, that more possibly are suffering from lockdown than cases. But suffering from what ? There's a whole lot of divorce proceedings going on here, and I am astounded. I mean, can't they stand each other 24 hours of the day ? Does their marriage commitment "for better or worse" mean fuck-all ? Yesterday we had crowds of boof-heads populating the beaches, most without masks, and certainly without any social distancing. There's always a percentage of the population who selfishly go directly against the best measures their govt (or the authorities) can bring forth. There is a time for independent thinking/actions free from the crowd, and a time to do the best to quell the pandemic under direction. It only takes one to start the spread of Covid-19 all over again. That's what happened here a only a few days ago. There is another very important reason why numbers of cases are crucial to the overall records. Many so-called recovered patients have been permanently impaired mentally, with brain, lungs, liver and kidney damage, general lethargy, and compromised immune systems. That's why the records for numbers of cases is so important. If someone three months down the track starts becoming disoriented, they can look it up and maybe trace it back to his/her Covid 19 episode. Take a scan and see if there's any brain damage, such as studies are now beginning to report. Check it out, there's increasing amount of that being reported on the Net. In other words, there is no guarantee that whoever gets and recovers from Covid 19 will go scot-free from permanent damage. The estimates right now are between 10-15%. That's serious. There is so much that is still not scientifically known about Covid -19. Every figure, every statistic is important. If the numbers of cases are increasing faster and faster (whether said number includes active/"recovered" or not), then there is a problem that is getting worse, simple as that. It can't be washed away on the back of decreasing numbers of deaths only, because that in itself may be because the medics have stopped inappropriate treatment, that's all. And is it fair to ignore "recovered" but damaged patients that may require medical treatment for the rest of their lives, just because they didn't die ?
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Post by mr potatohead on Aug 16, 2020 14:26:11 GMT
1...... The focus primarily on deaths is unrealistic as to the progress (or not) of the pandemic. If you have only (say) .0001% of deaths recorded in some pandemic, while the overall number of cases soar past 5 Million in the United States, can you seriously say that the pandemic is nearly over ? 2...... more possibly are suffering from lockdown than cases. But suffering from what ? 3...... There is a time for independent thinking/actions free from the crowd, and a time to do the best to quell the pandemic under direction. It only takes one to start the spread of Covid-19 all over again. That's what happened here a only a few days ago. 4...... Many so-called recovered patients have been permanently impaired mentally, with brain, lungs, liver and kidney damage, general lethargy, and compromised immune systems. That's why the records for numbers of cases is so important. If someone three months down the track starts becoming disoriented, they can look it up and maybe trace it back to his/her Covid 19 episode. Take a scan and see if there's any brain damage, such as studies are now beginning to report. 5...... If the numbers of cases are increasing faster and faster (whether said number includes active/"recovered" or not), then there is a problem that is getting worse, simple as that. 1. Yes, since numbers of meaningless "test results" are only a distracting noise. 2. I was still talking about suffering from death. Drug OD's, suicides, abuse in the home, attacked by thugs or riots, afraid or unable to obtain timely emergency help, etc, etc. 3. So, you're saying that the re-start of the spread was from people who showed the unique, observable symptoms - which is the only test currently available that has value? The medical people that I know say that the unique symptoms are the only indicator that they need to give attention. You can confirm this for yourself by asking your own local MD's or nurses who have experience treating people during this flu season and who actually care about the health of those that they treat more than they care about receiving bonus money from racking up positive test results and using ventilators. 4. True, depriving the brain of the O2 it needs is well known to cause damage. Using ventilators to try to force breath instead of supplying O2 for a lack of oxygen (hypoxia) in the blood at the outset is now known to cause damage from which there may never be full recovery. 5. The numbers of new "cases" discovered will continue to rise, in spite of no one dying due to the flu w/ symptoms, since the test has 0 clinical value except to signify that a person is human.
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macky
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Post by macky on Aug 16, 2020 23:43:09 GMT
1. Yes, since numbers of meaningless "test results" are only a distracting noise. 2. I was still talking about suffering from death. Drug OD's, suicides, abuse in the home, attacked by thugs or riots, afraid or unable to obtain timely emergency help, etc, etc. 3. So, you're saying that the re-start of the spread was from people who showed the unique, observable symptoms - which is the only test currently available that has value? The medical people that I know say that the unique symptoms are the only indicator that they need to give attention. You can confirm this for yourself by asking your own local MD's or nurses who have experience treating people during this flu season and who actually care about the health of those that they treat more than they care about receiving bonus money from racking up positive test results and using ventilators. 4. True, depriving the brain of the O2 it needs is well known to cause damage. Using ventilators to try to force breath instead of supplying O2 for a lack of oxygen (hypoxia) in the blood at the outset is now known to cause damage from which there may never be full recovery. 5. The numbers of new "cases" discovered will continue to rise, in spite of no one dying due to the flu w/ symptoms, since the test has 0 clinical value except to signify that a person is human. 1. While not 100% accurate, testing for Covid 19 is about 95% accurate if carried out properly. Certainly not universally meaningless. www.health.govt.nz/our-work/diseases-and-conditions/covid-19-novel-coronavirus/covid-19-health-advice-general-public/assessment-and-testing-covid-19/covid-19-test-results-and-their-accuracy#:~:text=No%20viral%20test%20is%20100,i.e.%20a%20false%20negative%20result). 2. In others words, the same as always. The problem isn't lockdown or isolation, it's the druggies, emotionally crippled and the violent arseholes who haven't got their shit together. Are we to imagine that that will stop if we release them from lockdown ? Many of them deserve to be in permanent lockdown anyway. Jail that is. The others that are intent on suicide will usually succeed, one way or the other. My son-in-law's family has two suicides to look back on. They waited until nobody was watching them and carried out their intent. 3. See 1. As for the flu season, my doctor ten years ago informed me that he loses an average of four patients every winter to flu and the complicating problems such as worsening asthma, heart disease etc. So do we ignore all the symptoms and tests for Covid 19 on the basis it's only another flu ? I have no knowledge of doctors or nurses receiving any bonuses or "kickbacks" from testing someone positive, or for slamming them on a ventilator. My only knowledge (plus personal experience) of a doctor receiving a probable kickback is for prescribing dangerous anti-depressants to a patient(s) for a sore knee and other purely physical complaints. It's not illegal here in NZ, I have been advised, and those fairly close to me, including a doctor, allege the practise is quite wide-spread. 4. It's not only brain oxygen deprivation. The virus is known to attack the brain through other measures. By now, there's about 300 studies according to here : www.bbc.com/future/article/20200622-the-long-term-effects-of-covid-19-infection#:~:text=Now%2C%20more%20than%20300%20studies,speak)%2C%20strokes%20and%20seizures. 5. Back to 1. Are you seriously saying that the test itself has no clinical value whatsoever ? Has it not been improved since the pandemic started ? What then are people getting sick from ?
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Post by mr potatohead on Aug 17, 2020 18:02:53 GMT
EDIT:
The test has no clinical value to specifically identify what has been labeled as "CV-19". This may be one reason that people who test positive, without the CV-19 symptoms, are sent home. If you don't have the symptoms, you don't have it. The test only reveals that your virus (exosomes) are possibly activated to remove the waste from an immune system response to some unidentified inflammation somewhere in your body. So, the test shows that your virus are reacting in the normal human way to something and therefore, you are assuredly human with a human immune system. The test does not identify what that "something" is that your body is reacting to - unless accompanied by symptoms. From cradle to grave, you will have the potential to test positive for a virus reaction to inflammation when it occurs, because, you are human and that is what your body's virus does.
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macky
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Post by macky on Aug 17, 2020 18:59:01 GMT
The test has no value to detect CV-19 specifically. All right. So Covid 19 being another member of the corona virus family, what are those positive tests picking up ? People are becoming ill after or during a positive test (not counting those that are "positive" but not showing any symptoms), so are those tests picking up some or all of the corona virus family, whether it's Covid 19 or not ? If in fact the tests are picking up other corona virus types as well, there is still a serious problem of impending (or current) illness which is making a lot of people sick, and some dying. If that is true, then the only issue is the statistics i.e. all corona virus-type illness being lumped together as Covid 19-caused (apart from the other basically unrelated deaths that are being attributed to Covid 19, according to your previous information). And are your tests that have no asserted value re Covid 19 specifically based on American research, or American doctors/whoever who are making these claims ? Or is this a world-wide thing, where all countries globally conducting these tests are picking up corona virus types other than Covid 19 ? In other words, is this an exclusively American test that has no value, or is this test a global test that has no value ?
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macky
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Post by macky on Aug 18, 2020 7:02:18 GMT
Meanwhile, Trump's getting more incoherent re the virus www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12357535"Trump made comments about the outbreak in New Zealand when he addressed a crowd in Mankato, Minnesota. "You see what's going on in New Zealand?" Trump said. "They beat it they beat, it was like front page [news] they beat it because they wanted to show me something." "The problem is [there is a] big surge in New Zealand, you know it's terrible - we don't want that."
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Post by mr potatohead on Aug 18, 2020 9:43:32 GMT
The test has no value to detect CV-19 specifically. In other words, is this an exclusively American test that has no value, or is this test a global test that has no value ? As far as I know, there isn't any test happening anywhere that identifies the pathogen that is causing our body's coronavirus to act up. The only tests I'm aware of are the ones that see our coronavirus RNA after adulteration by substances added to the sample and amplification. From comments I've heard and thinking about what makes most sense, I think the pathogen that is causing people's coronavirus to kick in was likely hatched in the Wuhan wet market. I've also heard speculation that the 5G fire-up coincided with the onset of the CV-19 and that it resembles other industrial age advances that coincided with disease outbreaks in the past. No data or verified reports on this that I've seen though, so who knows? I read that, as of April '20, there are about '130 FDA approved tests'. I don't know what that really means though (EDIT: i.e. are these 130 tests a combined total of mfrs, batch numbers or what?). I also read that there are three types of tests. One is for antibodies and the other two are RT-PCR, one quick and one slower, that tries to find active coronavirus RNA. The quick one seems to be viewed as almost worthless even by the modern med system. I don't know if these 130 tests or the three types of tests are used all round the world in the modern medical industry. You'd probably need to compare among test manufacturers', their part numbers or whatever and then compare with the tests done in other places? I'm sorry. I've re-read this several times, but not sure I understand what you're asking, nor that I have seen or heard anything that would give a clue to an answer.
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